'This Week' Transcript 10-25-26: Rep. Ashley Hinson, Josh Turek & Gov. Wes Moore

A rush transcript of "This Week with George Stephanopoulos" airing on Sunday, October 25, 2026 on ABC News is below. This copy may not be in its final form, may be updated and may contain minor transcription errors. For previous show transcripts, visit the "This Week" transcript archive.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

JONATHAN KARL, ABC “THIS WEEK” CO-ANCHOR: Americans are already going to the polls in 47 states. We’re on the trail with the very latest. “THIS WEEK” starts right now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KARL: Nine days to go.

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We still have to get out and vote.

KARL: Can Republicans defend their home turf?

What would you say to Iowans who are unhappy with Trump’s performance as president?

This morning, my exclusive interviews with the candidates in what may be the closest Senate race in the country.

JOSH TUREK, (D) IOWA SENATE NOMINEE & IOWA SENATE REPRESENTATIVE:  We’re a commonsense state that’s masqueraded more red than what we actually are.

REP. ASHLEY HINSON, (R) IOWA SENATE NOMINEE: And I’m not afraid to question somebody in power about something that I disagree with.

KARL: Our report from the Hawkeye state.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know, the president’s out there saying China’s paying the tariff, whatever country is paying the tariff, and I have to write a check for thousands of dollars.

KARL: And Maryland Governor Wes Moore on what Democrats should do if they win big on November 3rd.

Backlash.

TRUMP: I only wish I could have had an ad like that against somebody.

KARL: As Trump and Vance defend a controversial ad in the Ohio governor’s race, bipartisan outrage.

HINSON: I think it’s absolutely terrible, and I think they should take the ad down.

KARL: Our roundtable on the ripple effects for the midterms, and maybe even the next race for president.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: From ABC News, it’s “THIS WEEK.” Here now, Jonathan Karl.

KARL: Good morning. Welcome to “THIS WEEK.”

Nine days to go and nearly every sign points in the same direction. Poll after poll shows the president’s approval rating at the lowest of his presidency. Four polls just this week show a record low for Trump. And the non-partisan Cook Political Report keeps moving races towards Democrats, even in deep red South Carolina and Mississippi.

But not a single vote has been counted. And we’ve all seen election surprises. We’ve all seen polls that are wildly wrong as we do what we do, reporting on the races, talking to the experts, talking to the candidates, talking to the voters. It’s worth keeping in mind that none of us really knows how this is going to turn out.

What we do know is that interest is enormous. Early voting is underway in 47 states. About 26 million Americans have already cast ballots. In Georgia, more than a million people voted in the first week alone. The first day breaking a midterm record. In Iowa, Texas, Kansas, we’ve seen signs Democratic enthusiasm and voting is up. Those are states with Republican Senate seats that Democrats hope to flip.

And nine days out, the president is already laying the groundwork to challenge the results. On Thursday, the Justice Department sued to block Alaska from certifying its Senate race if the Republican incumbent loses. Asked about that on Friday, the president said, quote, “I’m the one that said do it.” That’s an extraordinary statement for a president to make. It runs against a fundamental American value that justice is administered without regard to politics, that the Justice Department doesn’t interfere in elections.

It’s also not a sign of confidence. Candidates who expect to win don’t start talking about contesting the results before the votes are counted.

I’m just back from Iowa, where Republicans are fighting to hold a Senate seat in a state that two years ago Trump won by 13 points. It’s a race that appears as close as any in the country, and it’s one of the many Trump is targeting in the final days.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KARL (voice over): Nine days until the midterms. President Trump is barnstorming the country as Republicans look to fend off a potential Democratic wave.

Trump has been on a red state blitz. And MAGA base is showing up, but so are the protesters. At virtually every stop, Trump is interrupted over and over again by hecklers.

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: These people are serious losers.

What I was about to say -- I'll do it again. Let’s see if somebody can interrupt me.

KARL (voice over): This weekend. Barack Obama made his first appearance on the midterms campaign trail, hammering Trump.

BARACK OBAMA, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: And there’s gold everywhere. What’s up with the gold? I -- everything that -- more gold. He’s got the White House looking like Saddam Hussein opened a Cheesecake Factory.

KARL (voice over): And in Iowa this week, Trump fanned the flames of controversy in Ohio, praising at length the widely condemned ad from Vivek Ramaswamy featuring the mother of his opponent, Amy Acton.

Acton was removed from her mother’s custody when she was just 12 years old after her stepfather was charged with raping her. They haven’t spoken since. Even the current Republican governor of Ohio has said the ad should be taken off the air.

GOV. MIKE DEWINE, (R) OHIO: I would just urge the Ramaswamy campaign to take this down. It’s just -- it’s just -- it’s just wrong.

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Well, I told him, leave it up and look upstairs and say, thank you, God, very much. I appreciate it. So -- but that’s a hot story today. They want him to take down an ad. I only wish I could have had an ad like that against somebody.

KARL (voice over): The purpose of that rally was to boost Iowa Republican Senate candidate Ashley Hinson, who appeared ever so briefly on stage with Trump.

REP. ASHLEY HINSON, (R) IOWA SENATE NOMINEE: Hey, Iowans.

KARL: Trump may not be on the ballot, but he is casting a big shadow over the Senate race here in Iowa. Republican Ashley Hinson trying to find some independents without alienating Trump supporters. And Democrat Josh Turek is campaigning like somebody who knows that he is not going to win unless he gets a lot of votes from people who voted for Donald Trump.

KARL (voice over): Trump lavished Hinson with praise in the Oval Office last month.

TRUMP: You’re doing a fantastic job.

HINSON: We’re working hard, and I appreciate your agenda.

KARL (voice over): More recently, Hinson has criticized Trump on Russia and called for an end to the Iran War.

Democrat Josh Turek, who was born with spina bifida, and went on to become a two-time paralympic gold medalist, criticizes Trump plenty, but he is also running ads promising to work with him.

JOSH TUREK, (D) IOWA SENATE NOMINEE & IOWA SENATE REPRESENTATIVE: In the U.S. Senate, I'll work with anyone to fix it, including President Trump, to secure the border, stop the flow of drugs into Iowa.

KARL (voice over): Tiny Iowa towns, towns without a stoplight, like Shell Rock, have been hit hard by rising prices and tariffs.

KARL: So, who’s buying your stuff?

QUINT GOEKE, CHANDLER LIMITED OWNER: We sell all over the world.

KARL (voice over): Quint Goeke’s family has run Chandler Limited for about two decades, manufacturing high-end recording equipment licensed by the legendary Abbey Road Studios.

GOEKE: The president’s out there saying China’s paying the tariff, whatever country’s paying the tariff, and I have to write a check for thousands of dollars.

KARL: But China’s not paying. You’re paying.

GOEKE: I’m paying right out of our pocket.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KARL (on camera): We caught up with Congresswoman Ashley Hinson in west Des Moines, just hours ahead of Trump’s visit to Iowa this week.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KARL: Before we get to Iowa, I want to ask you about what happened in Ohio. What do you think of this ad that Vivek Ramaswamy has run with Amy Acton's mother?

HINSON: Yes, it's terrible. I think about it as a mom, and you think about your kids surviving childhood sexual abuse and having to relive that trauma on TV again. I think it's absolutely terrible, and I think they should take the ad down.

KARL: What do you make of the vice president saying that he's disgusted, not by the ad, but by Republicans condemning the ad? I mean, by what you just said.

HINSON: Yes, no, it's ridiculous. It's absolutely the wrong tone. Iowans want, and probably Ohioans want someone who's going to be an empathetic leader. And I think it sends absolutely the wrong message. And I would bet that Amy Acton and I probably don't agree on anything either. But like the last thing I would want as someone who's running against is to force them to relive their childhood trauma. So, I think, again, I think it's wrong, and it should come down.

KARL: So here, back here to Iowa, what -- the president's coming to town campaigning for you this week.

HINSON: Yes.

KARL: Does that help when the president comes to campaign for you?

HINSON: Yes, I think you look at Iowa, and this is a choice election. This is a choice between going back to open borders and rampant illegal immigration, DEI, gender transitions happening at school for kids. That's the stuff that my opponent has voted for at the state capital. He's too liberal for Iowa, and so he --

KARL: He says he hasn't voted for gender transitions. He's -- this is a question of whether or not schools would be forced to tell the parents that the students had chosen different pronouns, but not transitions.

HINSON: OK. So, at school, gender pronoun differences, but taxpayers paying for gender transition surgeries. That is what he voted for. He voted for that to be allowed with taxpayer dollars. So, I was very clear that, you know, you look at his record. It is too liberal for Iowa. And he's taken those votes. And he should be held accountable for them.

KARL: But back to the president. He's here. I heard you say that he calls you from time to time. How closely is he following your race?

HINSON: I think the president's following what's happening here in Iowa very closely, and I think the president would consider me a little bit of a thorn in his side because when we do talk, I'm always asking him for something for Iowa. And last week when he called, or a couple weeks ago when he called to check in, I was like, sir, we need to make sure the soybean deal -- soybean deal gets done, right? So, I think it's really important every time I have a chance to have the president's ear, I'm going to ask him for something that Iowa needs.

KARL: So, he just calls out of the blue or do you --

HINSON: Yes.

KARL: Interesting.

HINSON: Yes.

KARL:  So, what -- what would you say to Iowans who are unhappy with Trump's performance as president, and they're on the fence about voting for you, but they're really concerned about what Trump's been doing?

HINSON:  Yeah. Well, I would say this: that I have chosen to make sure that I'm always putting Iowa first, no matter who is in the White House. So, I found common ground with President Biden. He and I didn't agree on much, but we were able to get some things done for Iowa, even when I was in the minority. I'm going to operate that same way, no matter who's in the White House.

Turns out, it is pretty important to work with the person who's signing the bills, who gets them across the finish line.

KARL:  You also said when you launched your campaign, you would be his strongest ally in the Senate. Is that still the way you see it? You're going to be Trump's strongest ally in the Senate?

HINSON:  If it's for Iowa -- yeah. If it's for Iowa, absolutely.

KARL:  No, no, no, that wasn't what you said. You didn't say for Iowa.

HINSON:  Yeah.

KARL:  You said his strongest ally in the Senate.

HINSON:  Yeah, I will be someone's ally when they're with me on the issues that are important to Iowa, and that's what I mean by that across the board. And if they're wrong, I'm going to pick a fight with them, no matter who that is.

KARL:  So one place you have kind of picked a fight is about Iran. You've said it's time for the Iran war to end.

HINSON:  Yeah.

KARL:  And we're now learning that the Pentagon is working on plans for a major offensive after the midterm elections. Pete Hegseth was in Israel meeting with Netanyahu. Are you okay with that? With a big new offensive in Iran after the election?

HINSON:  Well, I think timing is everything, and they need to do it when it's right. And I think what's important is I trust our U.S. military to bring this conflict to an end.

I do not think Iran should ever get a nuclear weapon. That is what is my end goal here. But I do think the war needs to come to an end. I've heard from Iowans who are being squeezed by the gas prices and the challenges we're facing here at home because of what's happening there. We do need to bring it to an end as quickly as possible.

KARL:  But that's not bringing it to an end. That's a major new offensive, and it's timed not to the conditions on the ground there, to the political calendar here.

HINSON:  Well --

KARL:  I mean, Trump was explicit: no attack until after the midterm elections. Is that-- are you okay with that?

HINSON:  I trust the president and the U.S. military to get this done on the time frame that works right to make sure we can actually achieve the result of making sure Iran does not get a nuclear weapon.

KARL:  How do you square saying you want the war to end now and you trust the president to do what's right? He's the one that started this war.

HINSON:  Well, I (ph) --

KARL:  He's the one that's talking about escalating the war after the midterms.

HINSON:  We don't need another resolution on the House floor because that's not going to do it. We need the president to bring it to an end.

And I think what's important is he is privy to a lot of information that we are all not, right? And we need to make sure that no matter what's happening on the ground here at home with elections, that we are doing whatever needs to be done to bring this to an end as soon as possible.

KARL:  Are you concerned if there is a escalation of this war after the midterms that it's going to hurt Iowans, hurt farmers, more diesel high prices, fertilizer, all of that?

HINSON:  That's why I want to come to an end as quickly as possible, so that our farmers who are in the fields right now experiencing that uncertainty, that we get that done as soon as possible, so we can move our country forward. You know, there are a lot of people in the country who feel like they've been priced out of the American dream because of what's happening in Washington D.C. and I want to make sure that we can return to those priorities.

That's why I stepped up to run in the first place. It's because I am raising my family here in Iowa, too. We're drinking the water here. We're -- we want everyone to have the dream of homeownership. We want to make sure childcare is accessible. Healthcare costs go down.

Those are my priorities for Iowa, and that's what I want to get back to focusing on.

KARL:  The president said this is an A-plus-plus-plus-plus economy. Is that the way you see it here in Iowa?

HINSON:  Well, sure doesn't feel like it right now. I think that families -- we did what we could to make sure that families experienced real relief with the Working Families Tax Cuts.

KARL:  Uh-huh.

HINSON:  Every Democrat voted against that, a $4 trillion tax increase on the American people if we hadn't done that.

KARL:  Uh-huh.

HINSON:  But again, there's more to do -- more to do to lower those healthcare premiums, which is probably one of the top things that I hear from folks on. They feel like these big health insurance companies are taking advantage of them, the PBMs, right? So, I think there's a lot to do there.

On gas prices, getting those down, we have a really important policy. This is something I nag the president on a lot, actually, E15 and biofuels here in Iowa. It's crucial for our economy. I think it's a great consumer choice policy too to let consumers at the pump choose.

So lower prices at the pump and a domestic market for our farmers here in Iowa.

KARL:  You've been a strong supporter of Ukraine. What did you make of Steve Witkoff telling Putin that he's a humanitarian?

HINSON:  He's not a humanitarian. He's a murderer.

I don't think we should be making deals with murderers and dictators, and that's why I stood up for Ukraine. I think that Ukraine is a freedom-loving country. I had a chance to travel there a few years ago and meet with President Zelenskyy and the people of Ukraine. They're incredibly resilient, and we should not be allowing a dictator to win.

KARL:  So, why is the president condemning Zelenskyy and dropping -- you know, lifting -- waiving sanctions on Putin? I mean, what's going on?

HINSON:  I don't think we should be making any deals with Russia. That's why I voted for strong sanctions on Russia just a few weeks ago, and frankly, I've been banned from going there. So I think that sends a very clear message about my approach to Russia.

Again, I want to bring all of these conflicts abroad to an end as quickly as possible. I don't think anybody likes forever wars, but certainly we cannot be empowering dictators to win wars.

KARL:  So, how would you do this? You get into the United States Senate. You just outlined two places where you have, it seems to me, strong differences with Trump on Iran and

maybe even more so on Ukraine. So, what do you do as a senator to challenge him on that?

HINSON: You challenge him in person, right? And that's exactly what I've done. I'm not afraid to tell him when I think he's wrong on something. And again, when he's right, I will be the fiercest ally for someone. And I think that's how Iowans expect you to do your job. They don't like empty rhetoric. They like results here in Iowa. And that's exactly what I've done. I'm not afraid to question somebody in power about something that I disagree with. And I think that's what Iowans expect.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KARL: After speaking with Ashley Hinson, we headed across the state to the small town of Shell Rock to meet up with her opponent, Democratic State Representative Josh Turek. I started by asking him about Trump’s visit to Iowa.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KARL: So, Donald Trump's back in Iowa, and I saw you say that you're glad. You're glad to have him back here. Why?

JOSH TUREK, (D) IOWA SENATE NOMINEE & IOWA SENATE REPRESENTATIVE TUREK: I said, I think that it is good for him to be able to see what cuts to health care, what cuts to, you know, the tariffs. I've said that the tariffs have disproportionately affected Iowa more than any other state. And I think that the war in Iran has hurt Iowa more than any other state. We've lost three Iowans in the conflict. You've got gas prices that have gone up more in Iowa than basically any other state. You've got an all-time high on diesel prices, and you've got input prices, like fertilizer prices, that have climbed. I think that it's good for him to come out here and see what federal policy has done to rural communities, to small family farms, and to Iowans because it -- this is a state that is hurting and hurting uniquely.

KARL: And he's here -- and he's been here before. I think he's coming back again. You've had Barack Obama in, I think it's three ads now supporting you. That's an interesting contrast because both Obama and Trump won here in Iowa.

TUREK: Yes.

KARL: I mean this, more recently, has been thoroughly Republican Trump country, but this was Obama country. Do you think these endorsements matter?

TUREK: Probably not.

KARL: That’s an honest answer.

TUREK: Probably not. But I do think -- one thing I do believe is that we're not a red state. We're a commonsense state that's masqueraded more red than what we actually are. A state that, as you said, we voted twice for Obama, three times for Trump. We have more Obama-Trump counties than any other state in the union.

KARL: What did the Democrats do wrong to kind of lose ground here in Iowa -- not just in Iowa but throughout the heartland?

TUREK: One is I don't think enough candidates spent time out in small communities like this. I think that too many Democrats over the last 10 years in this state have looked at this math problem incorrectly. This is just about turnout in urban areas, Des Moines, Cedar Rapids, Quad Cities. But, no, ultimately, this is a rural state. And you have to be willing to go to all 99 counties, every single, small, mid-sized community like this, and go out there and talk to people face to face and tell them who you are and why you're running. And I think that if there's been any change in Iowa, it's not been -- it's not been on the economic issues.

Like when I'm out there talking about -- because I'm a commonsense prairie populist, and I say, I'm for a livable wage, affordable housing, affordable health care, affordable pharmaceuticals, drinkable water, addressing Iowa's cancer rate, functioning public schools, infrastructure, and addressing corruption, I find that even ardent Republicans agree with me. If there's been any shift, it's been -- it's been socially.

KARL: There was an interesting “New York Times” poll that showed Trump's approval rating down considerably here in Iowa, but also showing that a majority of Iowans, I think it was 53 percent, think the Democratic Party is too far left, and also about 50 percent saying they're worried that you will oppose Trump too much. What do you make of that?

TUREK: I think that the term moderate has become a pejorative in modern politics, and I'm a proud moderate. I'm a, I define myself as a commonsense prairie populist, and I think commonsense might be the thing that is missing the most. And in my time as --

KARL: Has the party moved too far to the left, the Democratic Party? Do you agree with that, what the majority of Iowans said in that poll?

TUREK: I don't think a lot about the party as a whole. I think about myself, and I think about Iowa.

KARL: Yes.

TUREK: But I'll tell you this, that one of the things that I'm the most proud of in the Iowa legislature is I have been independently recognized as one of the most bipartisan and one of the most effective, because I have never gone and looked at this through the guise of tribalism, of, you know, I must support party and I must support leadership. No, I always voted my district, my conscience, and what was best for the people of Iowa.

KARL: OK, so let's take Trump. What do you think he's done right?

TUREK: Good question. I agree with Trump. He's done a -- he's done a better job on the border than Biden, for sure. I agree with him that we need to drive private equity out of housing. I would also like to see us drive private equity out of housing, healthcare, and nursing homes. And I agree with him that we should have no tax on tips, overtime, and Social Security.

KARL: So where do you see yourself working with him? Be immigration, those tax issues?

TUREK: Yes. You know, I say that Trump accurately identified the problem. He would go and, you know, when he was out here, and that's why I don't vilify people for voting for Trump. He said, you know, your grocery prices are too high. The system is corrupt. You're -- you know, I'm going to lower your electric bill. I'm going to keep us out of forever wars. But the result has been more and more consolidation of wealth and power to a handful of individuals.

And you look at the big beautiful bill is the most egregious example. 110,000 Iowans lose their healthcare in a state with a healthcare crisis and a cancer crisis. 119,000 Iowans seeing healthcare premiums double or triple. I mean, just in a state of 3.2 million, we've lost 842 healthcare entities in this state, while we're giving tax breaks to billionaires.

KARL: You're going to need Republican votes, and I saw you've got a group, Republicans for Turek.

TUREK: Yes.

KARL: And I also saw that members of that group include your parents and your sister? So are they really Republicans? I mean, are these --

TUREK: Those are real, yes. My father is a two-time Obama voter, three-time Trump voter. I don't know if my mom has ever voted for a Democrat besides me. No, it's totally serious. Yes, my sister Rochelle identified Republican. Certainly voted for Trump in every single one of the elections that he's been on.

I actually think it's benefited me to come from a family and the constituency that I come from. I'm the Democrat that represents the reddest district in the Iowa legislature, and the two communities that I represent, Trump won Carter Lake by 18 points. He won my community of Council Bluffs by 10 points. I was able to win by nearly six points, almost 15-point overperformance.

And for me to win, I had to go out every single day, rain or shine, hot or cold, and drag my wheelchair upstairs to have conversations with independents and Republicans, and I would hear from them, and I would say, this is who I am. This is what I'm fighting for. This is why I'm doing this, and win folks over one by one.

KARL: There are a lot of plenty of Democrats here in Iowa, a lot of progressives here in Iowa that are infuriated by what they've seen with Trump, and they want they want to hold him accountable.

TUREK: Yes.

KARL: I mean, you hear talk of impeachment, of, you know, accountability, of hearings, impeaching not just Trump but his various Cabinet secretaries. I mean, you know, Democrats are ready to take power and ready to get back at a presidency and a party that they see on the other side that they believe is lawless.

TUREK: And when I'm out knocking doors, there certainly have been abuses of power. But when I'm out knocking doors and I'm talking to Iowans, what I hear Iowans tell me is, enough of the political games. Enough of the political theater. Enough of the tribalism. I'm struggling to keep food on the table, a roof above my head, pay my electric bill, and keep gas in my tank. Can you please go up there and solve problems through policy in a bipartisan way?

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KARL (on-camera): Our thanks to Josh Turek and Ashley Hinson for taking the time to talk with us.

Up next, with polls showing Democrats just about as unpopular as Donald Trump, could this be the year of the independent? Maryland's Governor Wes Moore, who is endorsing an independent candidate in one key Senate race, joins me here on the studio.

We're back in two minutes.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT:  Imagine the power duo of Abdul and Elissa. You’ve got a Muslim man, you’ve got a Jewish woman fighting for you in the United States Senate. That’s something, Michigan, you can be proud of.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KARL:  There’s Barack Obama on his first campaign swing of this election cycle, appearing with Michigan Democrat Abdul El-Sayed last night.

I am joined now by the chair of the National Governors Association, Maryland Governor Wes Moore.

Thank you for being here, Governor. Good morning.

GOV. WES MOORE, (D) MARYLAND AND NATIONAL GOVERNORS ASSOCIATION CHAIR:  My pleasure. Thank you.

KARL:  OK, so what’s your sense? You’ve been campaigning around the country. Are we going to see a big Democratic wave, or is there a chance that Democrats are overconfident?

MOORE:  No, I think it’s not just that the base is energized. I think right now the base is enlargened. And that is -- that is -- that is important.

You know, I'm seeing it all over the state of Maryland where we’re campaigning for re-election. I'm seeing it where we’re campaigning for our redistricting amendment, Question 3, where we’re urging Marylanders to vote yes on Question 3.

But I'm also seeing it, when I'm out campaigning for other common sense leaders around the country. People like David Crowley in Wisconsin, and Amy Acton in Ohio, Keisha Lance Bottoms in Georgia, and Aaron Ford in Nevada. People are excited right now because they’re looking for leadership that’s not just going to push back against this corruption from Donald Trump, but push forward for a new direction.

KARL:  We’ve seen some movement, especially in the South. Talk of Florida potentially being in play.

MOORE:  Yes.

KARL:  Mississippi. South Carolina.

MOORE:  Texas.

KARL:  Do you think those places are really -- are really in play?

MOORE:  They are. They are. And --

KARL:  And if so, did Democrats make a mistake by not investing earlier?

MOORE:  They are in play, and we have made mistakes in not investing earlier. And I don’t even think just earlier in this cycle. I think earlier in this generation.

KARL:  Because you wrote off the region.

MOORE:  Correct.

KARL:  Hard (ph).

MOORE:  And, you know what, listen, I was -- I -- I am the third African American ever elected governor in the history of the United States of America. That’s not because I'm the third African American ever qualified. That’s because oftentimes there’s been chronic under investment.

And the truth is, is that I wasn’t the choice of the political party. You know, I wasn’t -- no party boss tapped me on the shoulder and said, you know, hey, Wes, you should run for governor. And I think we are seeing that when you’re actually able to invest, and we have good quality candidates, candidates like -- you know, candidates like Angie Nixon, candidates like Keisha Lance Bottoms, candidates like Scott Colom, right, candidates like Gina Hinojosa.

KARL:  Well, let me ask you about that, because that’s Texas.

MOORE:  Yes.

KARL:  Because there’s been all this attention, all this focus, all this money on the Texas Senate race.

MOORE:  Yes.

KARL:  But you look at the polls, that governor’s race, Abbott-Hinojosa, is -- seems very close.

MOORE:  Right. It is -- it is close. She is a good candidate. It’s the reason that we have personally invested capital into her race. It’s the --

KARL:  And the Governors Association never -- did not go in. I mean, not under your watch. But, I mean, it was -- it was very late to go into that race.

MOORE:  Well, yeah. And I -- and I -- and I think for -- the reason that I really wanted to make sure that we are putting emphasis on it is because when you have a chance to elect historic candidates that have a real vision -- and the wonderful thing that I feel about Gina or Keisha or Jermaine Johnson of South Carolina is that they would be history-making candidates. But making history is not the assignment. The assignment --

KARL:  It is to win.

MOORE:  The assignment is to win. And the assignment is to do things like making sure that we can provide health care for people.

The assignment’s to make sure that we can end child poverty. The assignment is to make sure that we can raise wages. If you can do that, then I think you have really good candidates who don’t just have a chance to win, but a really good chance to have a chance to make life better for the people in their states.

KARL:  So, let me ask you about El-Sayed, who has been a controversial and also energizing figure for Democrats. I noticed -- I assume you support him. You haven’t been out there to campaign with him yet. But one of the things that has drawn criticism is, he was asked a very direct question, who do you think is a bigger threat, Israel or Iran? And he called the question ridiculous and would not answer that.

How would you answer that question?

MOORE:  Well --

KARL:  Israel or Iran, who is the bigger threat?

MOORE:  Well, for me, I'm very clear. Iran has been a -- you know, the greatest state sponsor of terrorism that we have seen in a generation.

KARL:  Yeah.

MOORE:  You know, I fought overseas. You know, I was with the 82nd Airborne Division in Afghanistan. And I can tell you right now, we lost soldiers because of Iran, right? So, I’m very clear about the dangers of Iran.

But I'm also very clear on this too, is that when I'm looking at the issues that Michiganders are facing right now, when we are watching how inflation is up, unemployment is up, and the Trump corruption is up, that Donald Trump's family has done very well over these past two years. But the people of Michigan have not.

I think that the people of Michigan are turning around and they are thinking about, what are the things that are impacting my life right now. And I want someone who's going to fight to make sure that my health care is protected. I want someone who's going to fight to make sure that my wages are raised. I want to fight to -- have someone who is actually going to be a check against this unchecked executive, like we are seeing in Donald Trump.

And those are the things that I think -- it's not just Abdul has a thing about, but Mike Rogers actually is the one who needs to be answering those questions.

KARL:  So, you're a -- obviously a Democrat. You're a Democratic governor of Maryland. You're a national figure for the Democratic Party. But I saw that you endorsed an Independent against a Democrat for Senate in Montana, Seth Bodnar.

MOORE:  Yes.

KARL:  So, I want to ask you about a video that caught my eye this past week from Matthew McConaughey, an actor who has a lot of things to say about politics.

Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MATTHEW MCCONAUGHEY, ACTOR:  I believe in a fair fight. And a fair fight is not just two fighters throwing the same punches at each other for 50 years. Independents belong in the fight. Not as a protest, not as a spoiler, but as a real and potential winner on the ballot and considered seriously by us.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KARL:  So, he's saying that they're -- it -- this is kind of -- should be the time of the Independent voter, and then it would force both parties to come to the middle.

So, what do you make of that? Did -- is this a time for an Independent to emerge? I mean Democrats are unpopular, almost as unpopular as Republicans if you look at the polls.

MOORE:  Yes. Well --

KARL:  Why not an independent movement?

MOORE:  Well, so I don't come from a political background. I mean, running for governor is the first office I ever ran for in my life. And so I don't come from a political family. In fact, if you ask many members of my family, they can tell you about the policies that have hurt us, where we didn't come from a policy that's used to making the policies. We come from families that are used to suffering the consequences of them.

And we couldn't tell you whether, it's a Democrat or a Republican, that authored it, right? So, I actually think that, particularly as someone who did not come from a political party infrastructure, I agree with this idea that if you were just simply regurgitating party talking points, then you're probably not thinking hard enough. It is a time for Independent thinkers and Independent voters inside this moment.

KARL:  And you've got a bunch of -- you have several Senate candidates in Nebraska, Idaho, South Dakota.

MOORE:  That's right (ph).

KARL:  So, let me switch to 2028. There are a lot of potential Democratic candidates for president. So, can I do a quick lightning round with you?

(LAUGH)

MOORE:  Go ahead.

KARL:  A quick like one or two answer of what comes to mind when I mention these names.

MOORE:  OK.

KARL:  OK. Let's start with Mark Kelly.

MOORE:  He's a remarkable veteran, and I think just a really -- a really good leader and soul (ph).

KARL:  One or two words. You're already violating the rules.

MOORE:  Oh, sorry.

KARL:  Pete Buttigieg.

MOORE:  Remarkably competent.

KARL:  Josh Shapiro.

MOORE:  You know, I think a really -- a really solid advocate.

KARL:  Kamala Harris.

MOORE:  A really decent person and great vice president.

KARL:  Gavin Newsom.

MOORE:  A strong leader.

KARL:  AOC.

MOORE:  A passionate -- a passionate advocate.

KARL:  Wes Moore.

MOORE:  A two-term governor of the state of Maryland.

(LAUGH)

KARL:  So, you've been pretty clear over the past year that you are not running for president, but you seem to be a little less clear now. So, I want to -- I want to go back to something you said a little over a year ago.

You said -- I think we have a graphic on the screen here. You said, "I'm going to serving a full term as governor." When asked, do you rule out a run for president, you answered, "Yes, I'm not running for president."

Have you changed your mind on this?

MOORE:  You know, no, because I'm very focused on --

KARL:  You haven't changed your mind? So, you're -- you are committed to filling a full term?

MOORE:  Yes, I wouldn't be running for re-election if I was thinking about anything else, to be clear.

KARL:  OK.

MOORE:  But I will say, I do think Maryland deserves to be part of this conversation. And here's why. There's been no state that's been more affected than the state of Maryland by this Trump administration, right? We've had over 31,000 people fired in a year by Donald Trump that we have not -- that we have lost billions of dollars in aid and support, that we have watched our state continually attacked by this president.

But we've been the most, you know, affected. But I don't know if there's been a state that's been more effective in dealing with it.

KARL:  So --

MOORE:  We now -- you know, we now have a job growth rate that is -- you know, that is almost double a national average. We have an unemployment rate that is lower than the -- than the national average. And we have an economy that is moving, the fastest drops in violent crime anywhere in the United States of America are happening in Maryland.

KARL:  But let me get this clear, are you considering running for president?

MOORE:  No.

KARL:  I mean, so --

MOORE:  No.

KARL:  Do you rule it out? You won't run in 2028?

MOORE: Yes, my entire focus right now is on the people of Maryland. My entire focus right now is making sure that we are winning re-election on November 3rd, that we are having our people vote yes on question three, which is our -- which is our redistricting ballot amendment that we have. And the reason that I'm focusing on making sure that we can vote yes on question three is that Donald Trump is trying to actively rig elections and trying to make this pain he’s causing permanent. And so, by voting yes on question three is voting no to Donald Trump.

KARL: OK, well, if you do reconsider, we welcome you back to discuss that.

MOORE: OK.

KARL: We’ll have you back regardless, but thank you very much.

MOORE: I look forward to it.

KARL: Appreciate it, Governor Moore.

MOORE: Thank you.

KARL: Up next, what’s going on in South Carolina? Why are Republicans suddenly concerned they could lose a Senate seat there.

We’re back in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KARL: President Trump, overnight, launched a social media attack against a Republican senator from one of this year’s key battleground states, calling her a disgrace to our country. More on that with our roundtable when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KARL:  The roundtable is here. Former DNC chair Donna Brazile, “New York Times” opinion political correspondent Michelle Cottle, former North Carolina Congressman Patrick McHenry, and former New Jersey Governor Chris Christie.

Okay. So, Donna, I want to get right to the Vivek Ramaswamy ad against Amy Acton featuring her mother, but not so much just what the ad and the controversy. I want to ask you about this that J.D. Vance said about it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

J.D. VANCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES:  I have to admit that I'm a little bit disgusted when I see Republicans across the country who are whining more about that advertisement than they are about what the congressional Democrats and other Democrats want to do to the United States of America.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KARL:  Okay. So, J.D. Vance is disgusted, but not by the ad, but by Republicans criticizing the ad.

DONNA BRAZILE, FORMER DNC CHAIR & ABC NEWS CONTRIBUTOR:  Well, first of all, J.D. Vance, who calls himself a man of faith, should really think twice before saying that. This is a woman who survived childhood trauma, raped repeatedly by her stepfather. He was convicted in July of 1978. The only reason why he didn't serve time is because he ran as a fugitive.

And to use someone's mother in that way --

KARL:  Ran with Amy Acton's mother.

BRAZILE:  Thank you.

I mean, it's a sign of desperation that the gubernatorial candidate cannot campaign on what Donald Trump wants the Republicans on his record, because you can't campaign on a record of broken promises. It's a disgusting, despicable ad, and I agree with the governor. It should be removed from there.

KARL:  But, Patrick, is there any -- I mean, the way Trump and Vance have continued to talk about it. And Ramaswamy, of course, do they think it's going to work? I mean, is there a chance that it works?

PATRICK MCHENRY, (R) FORMER NORTH CAROLINA CONGRESSMAN:  No. There's an old axiom, just because you can doesn't mean you should.

KARL:  Yeah.

MCHENRY:  And in this circumstance, what Vivek is trying to do is go to the heart of his opponent's campaign and do it in such a way that breaks through the noise of the media. I get that.

But you have to have judgment on whether or not that is going to bring ill repute on you for making such a crazy accusation using somebody who's so -- has such an unsavory background.

This only highlights his opponent's strength. It shows a complete lack of judgment. And what you need in a governor is judgment.

And that is one of the qualities where you see Jon Husted, who is not at the top of the ticket. He's actually second on the ticket in Ohio, saying, “This is not sound judgment.” That's actually the smart answer here.

KARL:  Governor, you had some words for Ramaswamy when you debated him, if I recall.

CHRIS CHRISTIE, (R) FORMER NEW JERSEY GOVERNOR & ABC NEWS CONTRIBUTOR:  I did.

Look, it goes to a bigger issue than just the fact that this is a horrible ad and one that should never have been run. This goes to the rotten moral core that Donald Trump has created for my party. And you then take the two, probably two of the most prominent Trump wannabes in our party, J.D. Vance and Vivek Ramaswamy, and what they're showing America is, we want to be just as morally bankrupt as Trump, but we don't have any of the charm or charisma that people might like.

This is the future of our party if we don't get our act together, is to have charmless people with no charisma and the lack of moral clarity and center that Donald Trump has.

I think this ad showed much more about J.D. Vance and Vivek Ramaswamy and the cautionary tale for the future of our party than anything else that's happened in this election because if Ramaswamy wins in Ohio, we're going to see the exact same stuff in 2028. If he loses, I think it's going to be a real wake-up call for this type of conduct in our party.

KARL:  I mean, Michelle, they've kind of been alone among Republicans, I mean prominent Republicans on this.

MICHELLE COTTLE, NEW YORK TIMES OPINION POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT:  I mean you had Governor DeWine come out and say that this needs to be taken off the air. We've seen Ashley Henson in Iowa talk about this, former Governor Kasich. Basically, if you can't look at this ad and just say this is wrong, we should not be going in this direction, you need to rethink your basic life choices because I do think it's incredibly clarifying to Governor Christie's point.

This is a moment where you are watching the soul of the party just kind of turn into this Trumpian nasty bile.

KARL:  So let's look further out of the country here. We're seeing this week, Donna, South Carolina and Mississippi both moved in the direction, still favoring Republicans, but moving. Do Democrats really think they have a chance to win down there?

BRAZILE:  Let me tell you something. I talked to the former Chair of the DNC, Jamie Harrison. He said, Donna, turnout is phenomenal and I'm hearing that in Mississippi. I mean, look, Donald Trump is going back to Mississippi -- Mississippi.

KARL:  So what's driving that because these are --

BRAZILE:  What's driving it is because people are tired. I'm going to just quote Obama, "They're tired of chaos, the cruelty, and the corruption, and the incompetence." They're tired of going and filling up their tank and then trying to make groceries -- after you fill up your tank, it's just too hard.

The reason why you see more Democratic candidates soaring in these last closing days is because they are all (ph) message, we have good quality candidates from the heartland all the way to the coastal areas. This is a year where Democrats finally figured out we've got to talk with one handbook, and I think that's the reason why they --

(CROSSTALK)

MCHENRY:  I think that's overrating the midterm. The midterm, the party in power is on the ballot. President Trump going out and trying to get Republicans out to vote is a net help for Republicans because the economy is not up to expectations, the war is not going as planned for the American people, and the tariff -- the tariff battle has not been won.

So the economic message is the president came back to the White House and has not been realized by the voters. That is the headwinds. That is to the benefit of the Democratic Party. There is no message. There is no agenda from the Democratic Party. The worst thing that could happen to the Democratic Party for 2028 is getting control of both the House and the Senate, and I'm hearing this because --

CHRISTIE:  Because they've never had ownership.

(CROSSTALK)

MCHENRY:  They've ownership and participation in what's happening in Washington, but here's the point. The point is every little marginal piece of turnout helps on the Republican side. Democrats are certainly animated for this midterm like they were in 2018 in the first Trump midterm. And President Obama coming back out helps turn out Republicans, true. He is a turnout machine for Republicans in a way that Trump is for Democrats, maybe a little bit more for Democrats, frankly.

And then, finally, when you see Democratic congressional leaders saying what they would do with power, it clarifies this as a choice, not a referendum on the Republicans, and that's how the party should end, is putting this back to the Democrats on what they would do with power.

KARL:  So Chris, I want to -- I know you've thoughts on that, but I want to ask you about what we just saw from Todd Blanche and from the Justice Department saying that they're going to -- they are going to threaten to take action against Alaska if the Republican Dan Sullivan doesn't win, which is an extraordinary thing that's said, but then Trump asked about it.

He said he told them to do this. This is not normal. Am I right?

CHRISTIE:  No, it's not normal. And as I've said on the show before, I served as U.S. Attorney in the fifth largest district in the country for seven years and never once did I get a call from the White House, or quite frankly, from the main justice, telling me that you must investigate this particular matter or file this particular action, just didn't happen in my seven years there.

So -- but this is typical, and it's much more typical, as you know, Jon, broadly of Donald Trump's approach. His whole career, when you don't like something, you sue, and that's what he does. And so I --

KARL:  But can it work? I mean, can he mess with the results? I mean, can he -- does it matter? I mean this --

CHRISTIE:  I doubt that the state courts in Alaska are going to be concerned about what Donald Trump has to say about the Dan Sullivan versus Dan Sullivan problem.

(LAUGH)

CHRISTIE:  Look, it is a dirty trick in Alaska.

KARL:  Not for the first time we've seen by the way.

(CROSSTALK)

BRAZILE:  But he ran in August.

CHRISTIE:  Right. Reminiscent of things that would happen in Illinois and my beautiful state, New Jersey --

KARL:  Yeah.

(LAUGH)

CHRISTIE:  So Alaska now joins the crowd (inaudible).

(CROSSTALK)

KARL:  Is there another Chris Christie out there?

(LAUGH)

(CROSSTALK)

CHRISTIE:  If there is, I'm sorry for them. But look, in the -- in the end here, what the president is attempting to do here at the end is to try to do everything he can. He started it with the redistricting efforts.

KARL:  Yeah.

CHRISTIE: To know that he's going to have the headwinds that Patrick talked about. And let's put numbers on the headwinds. Two most important ones.

KARL: Yes.

CHRISTIE: Economy, in the Reuters-Ipsos poll, he is 27-69 favorable, unfavorable on handling the economy. And on inflation he's 21-75. 54 --

KARL: 75 percent saying --

CHRISTIE: 54 points underwater on the handling of inflation, which is what he got elected on in 2024. Here's the battle, Jon.

KARL: Yes.

CHRISTIE: The battle is between that horrible atmosphere and some of the horrific candidates that have been nominated by the Democratic Party.

KARL: So --

CHRISTIE: You can't be -- Michigan should not be competitive. Maine should not be competitive. But when you have. Abdul El-Sayed, Graham Platner, then Tory Jackson, Troy Jackson, rather, I'm sorry. These are awful candidates that are making -- bless their hearts, the Democrats.

KARL: So --

CHRISTIE: They're giving us a chance.

KARL: So, so --

BRAZILE: They are populist and they -- and I think they will --

CHRISTIE: They're what?

BRAZILE: They're populist.

CHRISTIE: They're ghosts is what they are.

BRAZILE: No. They're populist.

(CROSSTALK)

KARL: Well, we'll find out in nine days how this --

BRAZILE: But I had a great conversation with Chuck Schumer. But there's something else that's happened.

KARL: Yes.

BRAZILE: He's 70 percent underwater with Hispanics, 70 percent underwater with independents.

KARL: Trump.

BRAZILE: Donald Trump, right.

KARL: Yes. Yes.

BRAZILE: And he is 70 -- 70 percent underwater with young people.

KARL: And by the way --

(CROSSTALK)

KARL: We got -- guys, we --

CHRISTIE: -- winning Michigan and Maine.

KARL: We have to take a quick break.

BRAZILE: OK.

KARL: But I just want to say the senator that Trump attacked was Lisa Murkowski because she criticized this lawsuit, called her a disgrace to Alaska and to our country, and the worst Republican senator by far.

CHRISTIE: Not the first time he's called her that.

KARL: He will need her vote at some point.

Don't go anywhere. I have to get the roundtable's take on what Trump envoy Steve Witkoff said about Vladimir Putin.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KARL: All right. It was a big week in Trump-Putin relations. Take a listen to what Trump envoy Steve Witkoff had to say directly to Vladimir Putin as Stephen -- as Trump was getting a prisoner release from Russia. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVE WITKOFF, U.S. SPECIAL ENVOY: You talk so much about my president, President Trump, being a humanitarian. You are -- are a humanitarian also, sir.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KARL: So that's what Witkoff was over there to get Steve Hubbard released. All right. Michelle, I saw Kevin Cramer, Republican Senator, react this way.

"If I'm ever captured by Vladimir Putin, I'd rather die in prison in Russia than have somebody on my behalf refer to Vladimir Putin as a humanitarian." What is going on?

COTTLE:  I mean, I think it's really sweet, maybe the administration should put him up for the Nobel this year. I don't like -- Donald Trump deep into his second term is still doing everything in his power to look like a Putin tool every chance he gets, and it is shameful.

I don't think there's any excuse for what's going on, you know, and the explanation for why he does these things has, you know, it's like a parlor game in Washington. And I think it just boils down to, on one level, there's got to be some kind of financial situation here somewhere, is always been my suspicion, but also he just likes Putin. He's rich, he's powerful, he's who Trump wants to be and so, you know, why not sell out.

BRAZILE:  Well, has he complimented his physique?

COTTLE:  No, no, no.

BRAZILE:  I just had to say that. I mean, I'm sorry.

(CROSSTALK)

COTTLE:  It's a family show.

BRAZILE:  I'm sorry.

COTTLE:  It's a family show.

BRAZILE:  I mean, every rally Donald Trump is talking about some man's pecs --

(LAUGH)

BRAZILE:  And I'm like, dude, stop it. You're the president, stop it. No, this is a shameful thing to call Putin --

KARL:  A humanitarian.

BRAZILE:  A humanitarian.

COTTLE:  (Inaudible).

(CROSSTALK)

KARL:  (Inaudible) You're there serving in Congress when Trump did various things on Russia and Putin, but I mean what -- how do.

MCHENRY:  Well, Congress just passed with wide bipartisan support Russian sanctions that have been tied up for a number of years in Congress. And in an instant, we go back on that. There's bipartisan opposition to Russia, absolutely. But every president has tried to pivot to Russia for the last 25 years.

KARL:  Yeah.

MCHENRY:  Every president's tried this. And so what we see here is a gross display of, I think, flagrant rhetoric. And I understand if you're sitting there in these, like, to Kevin Cramer's point. But if you're sitting there and you're like, well, my word -- my way of getting out of here is saying a few words, so I can get out of a Russian prison.

KARL:  Yeah, but humanitarian.

(CROSSTALK)

MCHENRY:  It kind of clarifies the moment.

CHRISTIE:  This is what happens when you send a commercial real estate guy to do diplomacy. You see him talking to Putin, it's like as if he's sitting across from a guy saying, I take this space if we're $2 or less a square foot and if you do, you'd be a great humanitarian.

I mean, when you send Jared Kushner and Steve Witkoff rather than diplomats to do the work that's done, they're jackasses just like Trump.

KARL:  OK, we've got to take a quick break. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KARL:  That's all for today. Thank you for sharing part of your Sunday with us. Check out "World News Tonight" and have a great day.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)